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10/13/07 11:56 AM

Fellow Saint

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News Item:
Atheists gather in Wisconsin

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Good point Dessie. An atheist meeting doesn't hinder God's grace.

10/13/07 11:55 AM

Fellow Saint

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News Item:
Muslim scholars reach out to Pope

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Thank you, Dan for the heads-up. Holy Days or Festival Days are not obligatory and can be abolished(excepting the Lord's Day of worship) with good conscience. The Apostle Paul was grieved at how the Galatians were getting caught up in days and observatians and he mentioned this in the context of another gospel, not very different from the RCC's teaching that if one misses a holy day of obligation, it is a sin.

10/13/07 2:37 AM

Fellow Saint

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I agree Lurker. The basic Reformed doctrines aren't what I thought they were once I began to read about them from their adherents. I found out I was closer to them in agreement than I thought. Time for bed...good night everyone

10/13/07 2:27 AM

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Muslim scholars reach out to Pope

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Lance, it seems you have a different idea of what a Christian-derived heresy is. In my estimation, to be Christian-derived would mean starting out as a Christian(faith in the Lord Jesus Christ for salvation, as Son of God, God and Man, etc.) and then taking off from there and denying the centrality of Christ, his deity, saying He already returned, imposing traditions not outlined in the New Testament, etc.... However I do agree Mohammed most likely chose certain traditions from other faiths and combined them into something new, writing up a book at an angel's command. However, prior to Mohammed, the Apostle Paul says "Though we or an angel preach any other Gospel, let him be accursed...." What's the RCC doing with this admonition about angels and new gospels? Certainly Islam is preaching a different gospel thanks to an angel who visted Mohammed, wouldn't you agree? Shouldn't the RCC decree an anathema? It appears the Apostle Paul did. Same applies to Mormons and possibly Jehovah Witnesses, and countless other ministers who have "thus saith the Lord" messages coming to them regularly yet with extrabiblical words and commands.

10/13/07 1:28 AM

Fellow Saint

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Thanks Alan.

10/13/07 1:28 AM

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Atheists gather in Wisconsin

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I'd imagine many claim to be atheists because they oppose organized religion. So I am obliged to ask, what are they doing organizing this gathering?

10/13/07 12:48 AM

Fellow Saint

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News Item:
'Dear Abby' Says She's for Gay Marriage

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Many people look to these commentators like Abby as a bishop and shepherd of souls. Following their ever-widening path will lead to a great disappointment on the last day. Sad. True shepherds hold a staff and put up fences for a good reason. Abby has lost both.

10/13/07 12:38 AM

Fellow Saint

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Hi Alan....
Are you familiar with the Protestant Reformed Churches in America? I ask because I noticed the name of the author of the article about Speaking in Tongues you posted--David Engelsma. He serves the PRCA. Thanks to the PRCA and other Reformed articles online, my bias against the Reformed Christian faith has come tumbling down. Doctrines such as Limited Atonement and Preservation of the Saints are not what I once thought they were.

10/12/07 11:58 PM

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News Item:
One in five pregnancies ends in abortion

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Good one Daniel. Yes, just saying pregant relegates the mother to just being "impregnated." Of course, logic and experience shows, if a woman is impregnated, she's now with child. Of course apostate society tries to hide this fact. But their conscience is seared by a hot iron and needs healing. There is yet time for repentance and healing, but the day will come when the Lord's grace will not be found.

10/12/07 11:53 PM

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Muslim scholars reach out to Pope

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Hi Dan,
Thanks for the encouragement. Well, here's some assurance for you: If you testify of Jesus Christ as the Son of God and the only hope of salvation by grace through faith apart from works(which it appears you do), I say you are entitled to quote the Apostle Paul for yourself: "By the grace of God, I am what I am..." We are what we are by the grace of God....that being saints.

10/12/07 11:28 PM

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Alan H are you still there......?????? Got a question for you.

10/12/07 11:21 PM

Fellow Saint

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Muslim scholars reach out to Pope

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I'm in agreement with Albert, Dan, Dessie and Mike.

Lance, there's much more than just the Trinity. I'd imagine Muslims would take it as an insult that their religion might be a heresy derived from Christianity. Mohammed was not a Christian. He was a pagan who had visions and revelations and started his own group without first being in the Christian Church.

10/12/07 11:15 PM

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One in five pregnancies ends in abortion

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Well, the numbers are down, but I'm not rejoicing at all. This is deplorable and is a sign of the drain of immorality into which society is being pulled or swimming toward. Reject the truth and this is the consequence. What's really sad is innocent children are paying the price with their lives.

10/12/07 11:08 PM

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Catholicism requires unbiblical cooperation on the part of the believer to get salvation(holy days, penances, etc). CBC does not maintain such a doctrine from what I can tell.

10/12/07 10:59 PM

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Ephesians chapter 1 seems clear enough that election and predestination of believers and the work of Jesus Christ(his atoning death, the cross) go hand in hand. Is this correct, CBC?

10/12/07 10:34 PM

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News Item:
Poll: Southern Baptists say 'don't drink'

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Concerning Martin Luther, there are Lutherans who reject the consumption of alcoholic beverages. And yes, Mr. Luther could probably have had a clearer mind and better discernment of the Scriptures if he wasn't in bondage to what the Bible calls a brawler or raging. "Wine is a mocker, strong drink is raging: and whosoever is deceived thereby is not wise." Apparently for many of us, we'd prefer to abstain for sake of clarity of conscience instead of possible deception.

10/12/07 7:14 PM

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Hi CBC. My biggest concern is that people tie tongues to being the sign of the new birth, forgiveness, salvation...ultimately our justification before God. This cannot be. I know not all pentecostals believe this way, but the sects that do are growing and looking more acceptable in mainstream society. The New Testament declares that by the law nobody is justified, but that the "righteous(justified) shall live by faith." Any works a believer does, any manifestations or fruits of the Holy Spirit are because of justifying faith already in them, not the other way around. There's no other way to reconcile verses about works with verses about faith. One will either work for salvation and be sadly disappointed on the final day or they are believing unto salvation with works following them and these shall be welcomed glady by the Master of the house on that day. I think a good challenge to present to the tongues=new birth sects would be to present one verse, just one, that ties justification to speaking in tongues.

10/12/07 5:04 PM

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On a break right now and thought I'd come on into the forum. I'd encourage everybody to read what Alan posted. It's important, especially the part about tongues as evidence and the ecumenical movement. I will read the entire series of articles on the matter.
http://www.graceonlinelibrary.org/articles/full.asp?id=40||140

10/12/07 1:08 PM

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References to the pentecostal statements of faith I quoted can be found here:

Assembly of God: http://ag.org/top/Beliefs/Statement_of_Fundamental_Truths/sft_full.cfm#1

Pentecostal Church of God: http://www.pcg.org/s_22.asp

United Pentecostal Church: http://www.upci.org/about.asp

In case anybody missed, this, I post again: http://www.rickross.com/reference/upci/upci28.html

Wayne,
Thanks. I'll consider this today. It sounds like a possible confirmation to my question, especially if somebody is using a "thus saith the Lord" or similar exhortation and if such is in conflict with the scriptures, it is certainly wrong. "The scripture cannot be broken." I'm off to work now.

10/12/07 12:48 PM

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Sola Scriptura does not abolish the gifts of the Spirit. Sola Scriptura is at least a tenet of faith in pentecostal denominations. Rather the scriptures alone(Sola Scriptura) give the correct understanding of the gifts.

Examples of pentecostal churches holding to Sola Scriptura, in their confessions:

Assembly of God: "The Scriptures, both the Old and New Testaments, are verbally inspired of God and are the revelation of God to man, the infallible, authoritative rule of faith and conduct."
Pentecostal Church of God: "The Scriptures of the Old and New Testaments are the inspired Word of God (2 Timothy 3:16) presenting to us the complete revelation of His will for the salvation of men, and constituting the Divine and only rule of Christian faith and practice"
United Pentecostal Church(believes tongues are the sign of salvation): "The Bible is the only God-given authority which man possesses; therefore all doctrine, faith, hope, and all instructions for the church must be based upon and harmonize with the Bible"

I'd question rather they actually put into practice the use of scripture only to discern any revelations or correct understanding of spiritual manifestations. "Ye shall not add unto this word nor diminish ought from it." That's Sola Scriptura.

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