You guys argue in endless circles. From where does the doctrine of the "Secret Rapture" come? From ONE text, in Thessalonians, which must be read back to front to fit the secret rapture doctrine. The Lord will DESCEND (you say the Church will ascend. We will meet HIM in the air (to escort Him down) but you say He will meet US in the air (to escort us up). I think many of you should study your Bible more and spend less time arguing what you don't really understand yet.
To be an Arminian Dispensationalist (they do seem to be conjoined twins) you need to disregard or explain away such a huge amount of Scripture that it makes it impossible to class yourself as a "Bible believing Christian." The prooftexts for the 5 points of Calvinism alone can be found on almost every page of the Bible. "Seeing they see not!"
Kevin - It was the same Jesus who said, "If you love Me, keep My commandments." Do you think the commandments of God the Son differ from those of God the Father? Also consider the words, "Depart from Me, you who practise LAWLESSNESS!" Then look at the redeemed mentioned in Revelation who "Have the testimony of Jesus Christ AND who keep the law of God." This is the Word of Yahweh! Take heed!
The Dispensational doctrine of the rapture is mostly derived from one text, which must be read back to front to see the secret rapture in it. Thessalonians says, "The Lord will descend!" But they believe the church will ascend. The text says, "And we will go to meet Him!" But they say He will come to meet us. If the church is raptured out of this world, how will there be the gospel witness they proclaim will occur, as the Holy Spirit is in the hearts of His church? Isn't it time to put this childish fable on the scrapheap along with the rest of Darby's and Scofield's unscriptural nonsense?
I believe in God the Father, Half-mighty creator of heaven and earth, but unable to do anything in his creation unless his creatures are willing to exercise their freewill. The gospel of Pelagius and Arminius and Wesley and their ilk is NOT the gospel of Scripture, but the gospel according to the pride and self-will of man. I am amazed that so many say they believe justification is by faith. It is "By grace, through faith" and not of works, lest anyone should boast in the day they "made a decision for Christ". You all say you believe it is not of works. But your "decision" is a work, whether you see that or not. I thought this was primarily a Reformed and Biblical forum. You Arminians should do less humanistically inspired arguing, repent of your self-will and pride and go back to study your Bible for a while, without the accursed notes of Scofield.
The just shall live by faith!!!! On the ongoing debate re OT saints, as a newbie to this forum may I please add this comment - Jesus - "You must be born again!" Nico - "I have no idea what you are talking about." Jesus - "Of course you don't. This is a totally new NT concept we have just implemented - totally unkown in the OT, so you could not be expected to know even if you are THE teacher of Israel." Is this how some people read this passage? The need for a new heart in regeneration, new record in justification and new life in sanctification was known and preached and prophesied in the OT - read Ezekiel 36. And then ask yourself how could the last OT saint be filled with the Holdy Spirit from the womb?
2/6/08 5:58 PM
